Know Your Pagan Religious Rights
Speaking: Byron Ballard (Asheville’s “Village Witch” and Public Schools Activist), Christina DiEdoardo (Attorney & Activist), and Cara Shultz (Author & Civic Activist)
View the recording by contributing to next year’s conference:
Be sure to follow the link back to the Pantheon Foundation site to get your access code.
14:05:54 From Barbara Cormack : In and out of my window while I cook. Volume turned up so I can hear everything. 🙂
14:11:06 From Yeshe Rabbit : Reminder: the “More” button on top of your screen will allow you to pull down a menu that says “Fit to screen” which will help.
14:20:27 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : I look forward to looking at these slides better later! 😀
14:20:35 From Yeshe Rabbit : Right on!
14:20:53 From Vyviane : Thank you, I am a sucker for a good power point!
14:21:44 From Wytchfawn : It seemed more like a mud-slinging attempt which didn’t work. Proud of you Cara!
14:22:57 From Cara : thank you
14:23:16 From Christina A DiEdoardo, Esq. : Well done Cara! 🙂
14:23:22 From Heather Freysdottir : Floridian here. Every. damn. time. our local sheriff is fundie christian
14:23:43 From Yeshe Rabbit : Hail Grey-Eyed Athena, She of civic service!
14:24:20 From Wytchfawn : But, aren’t both unconstitutional? Mixing of church and state?
14:24:52 From Yeshe Rabbit : Not if they don’t express preferential prejudice toward one or the other, I believe.
14:25:00 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : ^^ That.
14:25:15 From Yeshe Rabbit : I think free distribution of materials is allowed, but no apparent preference.
14:25:29 From Yeshe Rabbit : I could be wrong, though. But that was what I got from following this case.
14:25:52 From Wytchfawn : I understand “all or nothing”…but the legality of public school is supposed to be “none”
14:28:27 From Wytchfawn : I get that. TY. That is a way of using the tools. 🙂
14:28:43 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : Not necessarily. In CA, there is a section in history classes at the jr. high and hs level where you actually explore Christianity from a historical perspective. Not the mythos IN the bible, but how Christianity took hold and spread and then in that the growth of Abrahamic influence, INCLUDING Islam which recently a father pulled his daughter from school because she was REQUIRED to read about Islam from a historical culturally relevant aspect.
14:28:56 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : It wasn’t prostelytizing, it was education.
14:29:41 From Wytchfawn : It’s like what the Satanic Temple did… handing out Satanic literature alongside the Christinas.
14:29:47 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : Yes.
14:29:51 From Wytchfawn : Christians. 😉
14:30:17 From Heather Freysdottir : when i was a schoolteacher, i was made to pray with the rest of the staff before standardized testing. we had a staff member who was a baptist minister.
14:30:46 From Camilla Laurentine : My old high school had (and still has) a ban on occult jewelry and school-sponsered Christian functions and clubs. I’m so sad this is still going on almost 15 years later.
14:30:50 From Heather Freysdottir : wasn’t in front of the kids, but still an example of Christianity in schools
14:31:36 From Yeshe Rabbit : Yikes
14:32:25 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : I worked for a SD where I was required to sign an oath typed in 1957 that stated I would defend the Constitution with my life in the classroom. I wasn’t in front of students, I was working in the office, behind the scenes. The oath ended with under G*d. I couldn’t get the job withOUT signing it.
14:32:33 From Heather Freysdottir : yep. we had one Hindu teacher, one athiest, and me standing thre awkwardly while everyone else was into it
14:33:50 From Vyviane : SD?
14:33:56 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : school district
14:34:28 From Vyviane : Gotcha, thanks!
14:34:32 From Erica Shadowsong : LOL
14:35:09 From Yeshe Rabbit : With allies, we can do more. With allies, we at least FEEL stronger abut our causes, even when it’s difficult.
14:36:53 From Keith V : From one of my favoirte songs… One spirit in the night, like a candle waivers. Many spirits joined as one, burn with the power of the blazing sun. There is strength in community!
14:37:13 From Yeshe Rabbit : Beautiful
14:37:28 From Vyviane : That’s Spiral Rythm yes?
14:38:30 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : In organizing, I call that contingency planning.
14:38:49 From Keith V : Yes. From their I Am album.
14:39:10 From Keith V : Youtube link… https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B1YecmPMMdk
14:39:25 From Wytchfawn : I think being a libertarian helps in that area…personal religion has no bearing on civic duty. 😉
14:42:49 From Cara : being libertarian helped in that Libertarians just don’t care about what religion you are – as long as you have no desire to impose your religion on others.
14:43:00 From Wytchfawn : Exactly.
14:43:54 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : surprises me: I dated one.
14:43:57 From Cara : but I had strong support from GOP and Tea Party. And Green party. Less support from DFl
14:44:09 From Wytchfawn : That is interesting and hopeful.
14:45:18 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : What is the likelihood that CA will enact RFRA like laws for the state and would it be of benefit to us if codified well?
14:45:41 From Rhiannon Laakso : my son brought home a flyer advertising Christian movies… from the security guard at the school
14:46:27 From Terence : Dan Halloran, a Theodish Heathen on the New York City Council, may have been the highest Pagan elected official before he was hit with corruption charges. Can the community recover that that kind of scandal, or does it paint future candidates with the corruption brush?
14:47:30 From Heather Freysdottir : Oh gods, Halloran….
14:47:39 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : Hee, I wasn’t the first one to say it!!!
14:48:04 From Heather Freysdottir : He didn’t represent Heathen virtues, but I suppose this just shows that no religion is exempt from corruption
14:48:11 From Vyviane : I have a question- If we do get into issues with our rights as Pagans, who do we call? Where do we reach out to?
14:48:16 From Heather Freysdottir : Halloran also made moves to distance himself from Heathenry too
14:49:20 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : If I want a hugelkultur that people can pick raspberries from, I’ma do it! 😀
14:50:00 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : But that comes back to food laws and how growers who deliberately turn their homes to homesteads and have “pick your own” areas still get fined for NOT meeting “food safety requirements”.
14:50:01 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : :/
14:50:19 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : People get fined for gardens that feed not just themselves. :/
14:51:01 From Wytchfawn : Some places have made public seed banks illegal.
14:51:03 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : Or for putting out boxes of excess veggies for people to take as they want or need.
14:51:06 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : *nods*
14:51:25 From Heather Freysdottir : which i think is a wonderful idea
14:51:44 From Wytchfawn : So could christians giving food to homeless people be arrested, even though their religion says to?
14:51:53 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : They have been.
14:52:00 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : Ft Lauderdale.
14:52:02 From Heather Freysdottir : in Ft. Lauderdale it is ILLEGAL
14:52:02 From Yeshe Rabbit : Yes, like that fellow in FL
14:52:03 From Wytchfawn : Wow
14:52:11 From Heather Freysdottir : which makes me ANGRY
14:52:34 From Heather Freysdottir : my state, my state, my state
14:53:17 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : Sit/lie law in SF are ridiculous.
14:54:41 From Terence : “Hollerin’ Dan”
14:54:50 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : TRUTH!
14:55:08 From Heather Freysdottir : I don’t know if Christina will have time or if it’s beyond the scope of this forum, but I have a friend who is trans* and feels that transitioning would endanger his livelihood. i know she’s probably busy but if I could ask her privately about resources for my firend?
14:55:11 From Heather Freysdottir : *friend
14:55:24 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : I don’t see why not. 🙂
14:55:40 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : Feel free to private message her and let her know it’s not imperative but give her contact info to follow up?
14:57:53 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : In Mexico, the words politician and corrupt are so commonplace that just the word politician is enough to remind others that the word corrupt is part of the definition.
14:58:42 From Wytchfawn : That is AWESOME!!!
14:59:01 From Mark Green : At least twice. Sometimes three times. If you run three times and lose, stop–it kills your credibility with voters. Try to achieve some other office, or appointment to an appointed position.
14:59:19 From Cara : exactly Mark
14:59:20 From Heather Freysdottir : Lady Liberty League
14:59:27 From Wytchfawn : There used to be a group called “Witches Againast Religious Discrimination” back int he 1990’s. Are they still around?
14:59:59 From Vyviane : https://www.circlesanctuary.org/index.php/lady-liberty-league/lady-liberty-league
15:00:08 From Vyviane : https://www.au.org/
15:00:26 From Heather Freysdottir : Institute for Justice is a libertarian org that is dedicated to workplace issues and freedom – a lawyer pal of me suggested them for workplace religious discrimination
15:00:35 From Vyviane : Thank you for answering my question!
15:00:40 From Keith V : They should have FAQs on tehir web sites.
15:00:47 From Keith V : *their
15:01:04 From Syren Jill : Whenever I sit with attorneys whether practicing or in education, I remind them of the power of listening
15:01:11 From Keith V : For you. 🙂
15:01:19 From Mark Green : Personally, I’m very hesitant about supporting a Pagan candidate just because they’re a Pagan. I’ve known Pagans who were sensible and public-spirited, and I’ve known Pagans who are batshit crazy. I’ll go case by case based on issues, my assessment of electability and prospective competence over any kind of identity politics.
15:01:24 From Cara : rabbit had her hand up
15:01:30 From Yeshe Rabbit : I can post here:
15:01:47 From Vyviane : If we were going to call a lawyer is there one kind in paticular we should call?
15:02:43 From Mark Green : Rabbit, that is certainly a concern, but I think it’s the hangover of the knee-jerk anti-institutionalism of the 60s, and that is fading. Again: the Pagan relationship with power is something we need to talk about.
15:03:55 From Lasara Allen : I know this is not on the exactly same page, but there is overlap; what kind of support is there for the poly family model?
15:04:03 From Wytchfawn : Why we need people in our community who KNOW how to work int he world.
15:04:14 From Lasara Allen : or even just loving extended family?
15:04:45 From Wytchfawn : NOLO
15:04:45 From Yeshe Rabbit : NOLO Press books
15:05:00 From Yeshe Rabbit : Laser great question
15:05:02 From Mark Green : Yes. Also great materials for setting up your own nonprofit.
15:05:02 From Lasara Allen : ^^^ what Wytchfawn said too. Yes, we need professional advocates. AND, that means those people need to get paid so that they can also survive.
15:05:40 From Keith V : My wife, who is a paralegal, says the NOLO Press books are really good.
15:05:42 From Lasara Allen : ^^^ and what Mark said about the Pagan relationship with power – personal and collective.
15:06:11 From Lasara Allen : it’s a conversation that needs to be had.
15:07:16 From Mark Green : This is good information–I didn’t know that about the cap on disability legal fees.
15:07:29 From Mark Green : Thanks, Lasara… 🙂
15:07:31 From Yeshe Rabbit : Right? V helpful
15:09:10 From Keith V : In Minnesota, there is a clinic at the William Mitchel College of Law in St. Paul.
15:09:15 From Terence : Celebrate the linguistic mono-specialists!
Ï15:09:30 From Keith V : You can also try the free findlaw.com
15:09:48 From John Medellin, Pantheon Foundation : YES THIS!!!
15:10:10 From Keith V : Findlaw i s a free product from Thomson Reuter.
15:11:12 From Vyviane : I have a possible resourse for the poly positive vendors
15:11:15 From Vyviane : http://www.polychromatic.com/pfp//main.php
15:11:29 From Syren Jill : A resource I use in my work with intimate partner violence – it is gender-based but the information applies across genders: http://www.womenslaw.org/
15:11:32 From Vyviane : I’ve never used it but have it saved in case someone needs it .
15:11:36 From Wytchfawn : There are even problems with traditional familes…who are divorcing and their religious backgrounds being brought into the courts when determining custody.
15:15:20 From Heather Freysdottir : here, here
15:15:21 From Mark Green : Recently, an atheist was awarded $2 million California because he refused a rehab program that was Christianity-based, and he was jailed because there was no alternative. I’m with the speaker: civic space needs to be religion-free space.
15:16:24 From Mark Green : Actually, the fastest growing segment in the US in terms of religion is “None”.
15:16:48 From Wytchfawn : Here! Here!
15:17:10 From Mark Green : I do think it’s legitimate for the state to intrude into religion to teh extent that it prevents campaigning from the pulpit.
15:18:58 From Mark Green : Given that Christianity is the overwhelming majority religion, in practice if you allow religion into the public sphere, the vast majority of such expressions, symbols, monuments, etc., are going to be Christian. I think Cara’s conclusion is exactly backwards.
15:19:13 From Wytchfawn : That would work if everyone actually DID it. But they don’t.
15:19:21 From Mark Green : ^This.
15:19:45 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : I think Cara was speaking to Christianity in government as opposed to Christianity in the public sphere.
15:20:16 From Mark Green : She was speaking to religious expression in civic space. I think she simply has it wrong, with all due respect.
15:20:24 From Syren Jill : I can see the relationship between the idea of colorblindness and the idea of no religion in civic sphere
15:20:40 From Cara : exactly Syren
15:20:44 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : ^^^ THAT
15:21:19 From Mark Green : That’s what happened in the civil case I mentioned in CA.
15:21:33 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : I think rather than pretend that religion stays out of governance, that recognizing that there are plethora of religious views (and even NONreligious views) and working from a place of equity is a better start. But that requires changing the dominant paradigm.
15:21:37 From Mark Green : It was a federal ruling, so that’s hopeful.
15:22:12 From Vicki : Xochiquetzal?
15:22:15 From Sam Webster’s iPad : Xochi
15:25:24 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : Thanks, y’all. :*
15:28:18 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : *snaps*
15:28:59 From Yeshe Rabbit : Paganism is a long haul, and so is community-building 🙂
15:29:10 From Syren Jill : Word 🙂
15:29:12 From Mark Green : Yes.
15:29:15 From Heather Freysdottir : Indeed, Yeshe
15:29:41 From Barbara Cormack : This has been a great panel. I’m so impressed with you panelists!
15:29:47 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : Yes!!!!!
15:29:50 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : So good!!!!
15:29:50 From Cara : no one will give you a seat at the table.
15:29:55 From Mark Green : Thanks to the panelists.
15:29:56 From Cara : go ge it
15:29:56 From Keith V : Thank you presenters!
15:29:59 From Vyviane : I second what Barbara said
15:30:05 From Keith V : It was an aweseom panel!!!
15:30:20 From Barbara Cormack : Also nice to have faces with names. 🙂
15:30:26 From Vyviane : All the presenters and moderators have really fantastic.
15:30:36 From Christina A DiEdoardo, Esq. : Thanks everyone! 🙂
15:31:29 From Xochiquetzal, SacredProfanity.com : #PACO #RITEACTION #PACORIGHTS